Natural Cold and Flu Remedies

Is your favorite cold fix fact—or folklore? In this episode, hosts Don and Steve team up with special guest Jeff Langford, PharmD, from TRC’s NatMed team, to bust the biggest myths about natural remedies for cold and flu. Together, they dig into the roots of popular remedies—from pharmacy shelves to grandma’s kitchen—to uncover what’s backed by evidence.

🍯 Is honey for cough a sweet solution or just a sticky myth?
🫐 Elderberry syrup: flu fighter or fruity fad?
🌱 Are homeopathic flu remedies backed by science?

Get ready for the verdict on these popular claims:

• Vitamin C and zinc can shorten cold symptoms.
• Honey is effective for cough.
• Elderberry can treat the flu.
• Homeopathic products, such as oscillococcinum, can prevent or treat the flu.

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TRC Healthcare Editor Hosts:

• Stephen Small, PharmD, BCPS, BCPPS, BCCCP, CNSC
• Don Weinberger, PharmD, PMSP

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Guest:

• Jeff Langford, PharmD, BCPS, BCCP (Managing Clinical Editor at TRC Healthcare for NatMed)

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CE Information:

None of the speakers have anything to disclose.

TRC Healthcare offers CE credit for this podcast for subscribers at our platinum level or higher. Log in to your Pharmacist’s Letter, Pharmacy Technician’s Letter, or Prescriber Insights account and look for the title of this podcast in the list of available CE courses.

Claim Credit

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Clinical Resources:

• Chart: Managing Cough and Cold Symptoms
• Chart: Managing Seasonal Allergies
• NatMed Pro 

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🌿🎙New show from today's guest: Natural Medicines: Evidence in Practice🎙🌿

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The content of this podcast is not intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment.

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Chapters

• 0:01 Introduction
• 0:21 Welcome
• 1:03 CE Information
• 1:36 Overview
• 3:12 Claim: Vitamin C and zinc can shorten cold symptoms.
• 11:32 Claim: Honey is effective for cough.
• 17:33 Claim: Elderberry can treat the flu.
• 22:46 Claim: Homeopathic products, such as oscillococcinum, can prevent or treat the flu.
• 25:36 Summary
• 26:04 NatMed Pro
• 26:58 New Podcast - Natural Medicines: Evidence in Practice
• 27:42 Rumor vs Truth Mailbag: Dental Dilemmas
• 29:43 A few more things...
• 30:56 Find us on YouTube!

Transcript

This transcript is automatically generated. 

00:00:00 Narrator: Welcome to Rumor vs Truth, your trusted source for facts, where we dissect the evidence behind risky rumors and reveal clinical truths. Today, we'll stir the pot with natural remedies for cold and flu symptoms.

00:00:21 Don Weinberger:

Hey, Steve. How you doing?

00:00:22 Steve Small:

Doing all right, Don. How about you?

00:00:24 Don Weinberger:

Not too bad. Hey, I have to ask you, what is your go to remedy when you have a cold or flu?

00:00:31 Steve Small:

Oh, well, usually it's probably a lot of chicken soup and a healthy dose of denial because I do not like being sick. What about you?

00:00:39 Don Weinberger:

Uh. Same thing. Uh, chicken. Some kind of clear soda. And a full day of price is right. Oh, so.

00:00:46 Steve Small:

That that clears all ills. Yeah, yeah. And I'm Steve, the pharmacist.

00:00:50 Don Weinberger:

And I'm Don the pharmacist. And in this episode, we're going to brew up some clarity on natural medicines used for cold and flu symptoms. Uh, was grandma right about some of those old remedies.

00:01:01 Steve Small:

We're gonna find out if she was. And great news. This podcast now offers continuing education credit for pharmacists, pharmacy technicians, nurses and physicians subscribed at our platinum level or higher.

00:01:12 Don Weinberger:

Yeah, just log into your pharmacist's letter, pharmacy technicians letter or Prescriber insights account and look for the title of this podcast in the list of available CE courses. So for purposes of disclosure, none of our speakers have anything to disclose right now.

00:01:25 Steve Small:

Don't worry folks, even though we're adding CE here, we're still going to have all the puns that you know and love from us.

00:01:33 Don Weinberger:

We are naturals at it after all.

00:01:34 Steve Small:

Oh good one Don. So first let's dig into some roots of natural medicines first, especially the stats behind it. Did you know, Don, that over thirty percent of people in the US, and we're talking eighty percent of people in the world, use natural medicines and home remedies to treat cold and flu symptoms, things like sore throat and cough.

00:01:54 Don Weinberger:

You know, I had to hide my shock face, but I believe it. You know, I've seen the cold and flu section at my pharmacy, at other pharmacies, and it's just packed full of all these vitamins and supplements for preventing and treating cold and flu symptoms.

00:02:07 Steve Small:

Oh for sure. And so while we squeeze out the truth on these claims, stick around. We're also going to answer a listener's question about dental health from our last episode.

00:02:15 Don Weinberger:

Yep. And all right, Steve, before we leaf through that first claim, we got another blossoming moment for the show.

00:02:23 Steve Small:

Yeah, we're thrilled to welcome a special guest drummer versus truth, someone who's not only a fellow editor here at TRC healthcare, but also brings deep expertise with natural medicines.

00:02:33 Don Weinberger:

That's right. So please welcome Jeff Langford, PharmD, Bcps Bcgp. He's a managing clinical editor with TRC, Nat Med Products, and he wanted to plant himself right here. In truth, we heard we were tackling myths about natural medicine products for cold and flu.

00:02:50 Jeff Langford:

Well, thanks Steve and Don. I'm excited to dig in here with you guys today. Natural medicines are certainly always alive. It's an area that's packed with misconceptions and sometimes misinformation, and I'm looking forward to offering some sage advice on this and help clear things up for you all and for our listeners.

00:03:07 Don Weinberger:

Jeff, you're going to fit right in with those puns, I guarantee. For sure. So with that, let's peel away the layers of this first claim. And it is vitamin C and zinc can shorten cold symptoms. And Jeff, I said earlier about pharmacy stocking just a ton of these products. Right. And looking at the labels, you see a lot of them contain things like vitamin C and zinc. That's kind of seems the common thread with these particular products. So and I say ton, I don't think I'm exaggerating a whole, whole lot. So what's the deal? And why do so many of these natural cold and flu meds and supplements have vitamin C and zinc in them?

00:03:44 Jeff Langford:

Yeah. Great question and absolutely concur with what you're saying there, Don. We see these things stacking up on pharmacy shelves and on social media claims about their benefit. Um, and it's partly for good reason we'll discuss that. But we'll start with vitamin C. It's been theorized to be helpful for colds for over seventy years, and some data show that oral vitamin C, in high doses, a gram or more per day might decrease the duration of cold symptoms. But it's not by very much about a day to a day and a half shorter duration of cold symptoms. Now, Don, I expect that you're going to kind of juiced about this before you do. Let's think about some of the caveats. Um, these studies in general looked at taking vitamin C regularly, not just when the cold symptoms started. So to get a benefit, people were taking it all the time. If they were already taking it before they got a cold. It might be a day or a day and a half less with symptoms than people that weren't taking vitamin C at all. On top of that, the doses were high, generally a gram or more, as I said, but sometimes it went up to four grams per day. Um, that's a lot of vitamin C, because our supplement doses usually are going to be in the five hundred to one thousand milligram per tablet or capsule range.

00:05:01 Steve Small:

Yeah, that's quite the pill burden for folks who are really into juice. The juicers out there. Uh, I found that there's about forty milligrams of vitamin C in an average orange and about one hundred and twenty five milligrams of vitamin C in a typical serving, or one cup of orange juice. So there would be quite a juice burden here for those folks as well. If they went that route, it could be up to thirty two glasses of juice, right? That's pretty astounding. Uh, but with that, let's jump to zinc. I often see this paired with vitamin C, Jeff.

00:05:30 Jeff Langford:

Yeah, absolutely. Steve. That's kind of the second half of this question. And when we look at zinc, a little bit different nuance here. Majority of clinical trials do show that we get a decrease in the duration of common cold symptoms. So again nasal symptoms that that go along with colds when adults are using zinc lozenges, that's usually like the zinc acetate or zinc gluconate. Lozenge strengths are typically like nine to twenty four milligrams of zinc in those. And we saw a little bit bigger benefit here Mean or average duration of cold symptoms was shortened by about three days with zinc. Think back to that vitamin C we were saying about a day to a day and a half. So slightly larger potential benefit with zinc in this case.

00:06:12 Don Weinberger:

So yeah, looking at this data, Jeff, wasn't the frequency of intake of zinc a little surprising?

00:06:20 Jeff Langford:

It's pretty intense. Don. Yeah. So these studies typically looked at using zinc lozenges every two hours while awake. So that's up to eight lozenges potentially a day for many people. And you had to start it within forty eight hours of symptom onset. Um, that typically stacked up over the course of that day to a dose of zinc of around seventy five milligrams. Note the difference here is we're talking about starting zinc. When cold symptoms start with vitamin C. We're saying use it all the time. Um, in either case to to shorten duration of cold symptoms.

00:06:55 Steve Small:

Yeah. It's good to point out that difference and good to know about the actual evidence that vitamin C and zinc can reduce the days of cold symptoms, but vitamin D needs to be sorry. Vitamin C needs to be taken regularly prior to the cold, but that is really frequent dosing for zinc lozenges. I can barely remember to take a daily multivitamin, so I could see some people really not being able to keep up with that if they're feeling crummy doing that every two hours. And plus, we know if something is natural doesn't necessarily mean that it's free of side effects or other issues, right?

00:07:26 Jeff Langford:

Absolutely, Steve, that's kind of our take home point when we talk about natural medicines. And we really have to keep that perception top of mind, or that information top of mind to help kind of reset perceptions for, for patients. But when we think about vitamin C, for example, we consider the tolerable upper intake level for that to be about two thousand milligrams a day. More than that can lead to GI side effects like diarrhea, stomach cramps, um, and and high doses. Even one thousand milligrams or more per day has been linked to an increased risk of kidney stones. Um, Particularly in patients that are prone to them, and that might be patients with a previous kidney stone. Um, we generally think that if you've had a history of a stone that increase, especially about thirty to fifty percent higher chance of having another one. So if you throw some vitamin C in the mix, uh, risk could go up from there. So those are kinds of things that we need to talk to patients about when we're talking about natural medicines or any medicines. Um, and on the zinc, half of it, zinc, of course, has an unpleasant taste. So you mentioned taking those lozenges eight times a day, not only remembering it, but it doesn't taste good. That's not going to help things out there either. And lots of considerations with zinc in terms of drug interactions. We know as pharmacists we very commonly counseling about things that can bind with certain antibiotics or HIV meds and reduce absorption. Zinc would go in that category of things that can do that as well.

00:08:53 Don Weinberger:

All right. Thank you Jeff. Yeah these drug interaction stuff in there as well. Uh, so patients actually might be triggering their cold symptoms for gastrointestinal symptoms and metallic taste in the mouth. So good for everybody to know that one. And actually reminds me of this. Might be before your time, Steve, but actually reminds me of that intranasal zinc, uh, that they pulled from shelves. Geez. Probably over a decade by now. Um, for people losing their sense of smell with it in some cases, actually permanently. Um, so if your patients are asking for nasal products for cold remedies now, they are zinc free and usually homeopathic in those cases.

00:09:29 Steve Small:

Good point, Don. I'm glad we sniffed out the truth on that one.

00:09:33 Don Weinberger:

Okay. All right. Uh, let's going back to that claim. So the claim is vitamin C and zinc can shorten cold symptoms. And the verdict is. True with conditions vitamin C and zinc can shorten the number of days with cold symptoms. But be ready for those caveats. Like Jeff mentioned with um, uh, that to be taken regularly for vitamin C and also the side effects with zinc come into play.

00:09:59 Steve Small:

Yeah. Good point. And circling back. Does vitamin C and zinc work in preventing colds because so far we talked about treatment. I see people popping everything they can before flights so they don't get sick. What do you think, Jeff?

00:10:11 Jeff Langford:

Yeah. Great follow up question there Steve. No, no clear benefit for prevention in either case. Overall, when vitamin C has been studied for prevention, it doesn't seem to affect the risk of getting a cold from most patients. And with zinc, data are mixed, but they're too mixed to be reliable to consider it really effective or something to to recommend to our patients. So we really want to kind of hang our hat and continue to emphasize good prevention strategies instead of vitamin C or zinc. And that would be things like avoiding touching your your face and eyes, appropriate handwashing, disinfecting surfaces and all of those good, uh, proven strategies.

00:10:49 Steve Small:

Yeah, thanks.

00:10:50 Don Weinberger:

I touched my face and eyes during this entire podcast. Thank you though. Thanks for thanks. That's a good reminder.

00:10:55 Steve Small:

And always there to help out. Maybe you done with this? It's a good time.

00:11:00 Don Weinberger:

Please.

00:11:01 Steve Small:

We have a great online resource managing cough and cold Symptoms, where you can review all of these considerations. Check it out. Especially you Don.

00:11:10 Don Weinberger:

And you know we're talking about vitamin C. And juice actually takes me back to our very first episode, Juicy Interactions. And you want to know more about how fruit juice, like orange and grapefruit juice, can mess with certain meds? Uh, that's a great one to check out in our back catalog.

00:11:25 Steve Small:

Yeah, those were the days, Don. A very good throwback. Definitely a good episode. And you could say it's our preachy era.

00:11:31 Don Weinberger:

Yeah. Good call out.

00:11:32 Steve Small:

And let's tackle our sweet next claim. That always gets a lot of buzz, you could say. And it's that honey is effective for cough. And it's kind of makes me think back to like, Mary Poppins. And her whole spoonful of sugar makes the medicine go down, right. Uh, except that the actual medicine is sugar itself, essentially. So, Jeff, what does the data say about the use of honey for cough?

00:11:55 Jeff Langford:

I like this one, Steve, because I think it's an area that is promising for people, and it's also pretty simple. And the answer is that most studies show that oral honey reduces cough in kids. Um, studies have looked at doses around two point five to ten mls. It seems to reduce the severity of nighttime cough, uh, as well as the frequency of nighttime cough. All of that leads to kids sleeping better and probably in turn, parents sleeping better. That piece wasn't in the study, but just kind of throwing that consideration in there. Um, the data is mostly in kids two and older, uh, when they have some kind of upper respiratory tract infection. And honey has also been compared. So those studies were looking at it versus a placebo. Uh, but it's also been compared to other active treatments. They looked at it versus say dextromethorphan for example. And honey seems to be at least as effective as dextromethorphan for suppressing cough in kids.

00:12:49 Don Weinberger:

So good news for those who wish to avoid the side effect. Dextromethorphan, right? You know, some people tend to feel a little loopy on it in those effects can be compounded in children. You did kind of emphasize children earlier, Jeff. And so naturally the question comes to what about adults? What about me? What if I want to do that. Spoon. Spoon full of sugar for that cough. What's the advice there?

00:13:13 Jeff Langford:

Yeah. The data in adults are unclear. So there is a meta analysis of research that looked at honey in adults and suggests that it doesn't improve cough when compared to usual care. But statistics come in here and there's just a very limited pool of data. So small number of studies to start with. And that analysis may have been underpowered to detect a benefit, particularly if that benefit was kind of small.

00:13:40 Steve Small:

Yeah. I like that you bring up the statistical piece there. And for those who may not be familiar with what power is, if something's inadequately powered in terms of a study, that means that it's lacking something. Usually it's lacking enough participants, especially if maybe the effect we're looking for is really rare or low. So if you don't have enough patients or subjects in that study. You may not find a change even if it is true. So that might be what we're seeing with honey.

00:14:03 Jeff Langford:

Yeah. Powerful thought there, Steve, I like that. Um, some research in adults has looked at combinations, however. And so for example, honey has been combined with other things like mixed with coffee into a paste. And in that case, it did suggest some benefits. So there there are some other pieces of data out there looking at different things.

00:14:24 Steve Small:

Yeah. Uh, paste does not sound appetizing.

00:14:27 Jeff Langford:

Not particularly.

00:14:28 Don Weinberger:

I think I'd rather have a cough.

00:14:29 Steve Small:

Yeah, right.

00:14:29 Don Weinberger:

Right.

00:14:31 Steve Small:

But is it okay if adults want to try, honey, at least?

00:14:34 Jeff Langford:

Yeah. I think what we want to ensure in that conversation is just that we give a balanced perspective. We want to let people know that the data doesn't necessarily support a benefit, but there's probably very little risk. In this case, we'd want to consider any possible downsides. So for example, if a patient has particularly uncontrolled blood glucose giving, taking extra honey with glucose in it may lead to higher levels. In that scenario, theoretically, but for many people, be absolutely fine to give it a try.

00:15:06 Steve Small:

Nice.

00:15:08 Don Weinberger:

All right. And one thing I kind of noticed when I was looking at the honey products is they're all created the same. So there's actually one called rhododendron honey that contains something called a toxin. And that actually can lead to cardiovascular side effects. I've saw some like hypotension, low blood pressure, arrhythmias and chest pain. And it's actually actually called mad honey, which is a fun kind of term to kind of let patients know when they're choosing products, uh, to be careful, uh, when they're kind of purchasing those different honey, uh, products out there. Yeah.

00:15:42 Steve Small:

Uh, and with that, let's go back to our claim that honey is effective for cough. And the verdict is. True with conditions. It's shown to be effective in kids, but not necessarily adults. And adults are free to try it since risks are low. Plus, we all know it's tasty. And this also had me thinking, folks, that I'm a pediatric pharmacist and we avoid honey in kids under one, since their stomachs can't effectively destroy botulism spores that could be found in some honey. So botulism can be deadly. Think about that.

00:16:13 Don Weinberger:

Yeah, yeah. Good call out, Steve. And then I'm thinking about honey again because I just can't make up my mind. Uh, you know, on my way home, driving on the side road. I do see, like, these stands for locally sourced honey and looking up. There's actually quite a big market for locally sourced honey. Uh, Jeff, does that help out at all?

00:16:32 Jeff Langford:

Yeah. So people tend to reach for locally sourced products honey for allergy prevention. So lots of interest in it in that space. But no good proof that locally sourced honey or even honey in general is good for allergy prevention or treatment.

00:16:47 Steve Small:

Okay, that's good to know. So it is okay to go to Big honey when it comes to this. So thanks Jeff for that. And what uh, what you can also let audience know is to check out our managing Seasonal allergies. We have a great chart online with this topic for more improvement treatments.

00:17:03 Don Weinberger:

Beautiful, Steve. I remind folks in the audience, take a look at the show notes for this episode. We link directly to the chart in pharmacist's letter, pharmacy Technicians Letter and Prescriber Insights, and a few other related to this episode for easy access.

00:17:17 Steve Small:

Yeah, and if you aren't already a subscriber, don't miss out on these resources. Sign up today to stay ahead with trusted insights and tools.

00:17:24 Don Weinberger:

And don't forget, our subscribers can claim CE credit for listening to this episode. There's a handy link in the show notes that take you right to this e-course. Once you finish listening and let's go ahead and not beat around the bush with this next claim. And it is. Elderberry can treat the flu. So I've seen elderberry a lot of different products out there. It's an elixirs, capsules, teas and other drinks. Uh, with claims of improving flu symptoms. So it's pretty popular. Uh, Jeff, we're all very curious. Is there a truth to this claim?

00:18:00 Jeff Langford:

Yeah, a good one. Elderberry is possibly effective for reducing the severity of flu symptoms. So the achiness coughs based on small studies. And those are in generally healthy adults with the flu. Um, some things to know about those studies, as we kind of turn that over a little bit, is that the dose is varied. So we some of them used elderberry extract lozenges like one hundred and seventy five milligram doses or an elderberry extract syrup, typically fifteen millilitres. And those were dosed four times a day over a course of two to five days. Again, people needed to start fairly early after symptoms began, so within a day or two. And in those cases, what they found in the those groups of patients is that flu symptoms improved about four days earlier than the control group. Um, symptoms didn't necessarily go away, but they improved. Um, and it did reduce the use of what we think of as rescue medication. So analgesics. G6, traditional conventional cough and cold medications. But and there is a big but here not all data are positive. It's not been shown to reduce the overall duration of flu symptoms, and there also isn't any good evidence for elderberry extract in kids, even though if you look on pharmacy shelves in a supplement sections, you're probably going to see some things that are that are labeled or kind of targeted toward using kids.

00:19:22 Steve Small:

Yeah, really good distinctions to sort through those claims. Jeff and Elderberry can reduce severity, but not duration of flu symptoms. Uh, what about the safety behind elderberry here?

00:19:34 Jeff Langford:

Okay. And that's an important, important distinction, Steve. What we want to think about is that these extracts, or the oral elderberry extracts that were studied for flu, do seem to be well tolerated in short term data. But there are some caveats. And that's that elderberry itself, especially raw or unripe berries or other pieces of the plant, can be toxic. They have a cyanide producing chemical that can cause some serious toxicity. If patients eat again, the raw or unripe berries or other plant parts that aren't cooked. So we definitely want to kind of draw out that distinction between the extract syrups and lozenges and elderberry and other forms. Um, and probably another important consideration in this space is that there's not good data for patients who are pregnant or lactating. So we want to discourage use in those patients just based on the lack of evidence.

00:20:26 Steve Small:

Yeah, good call up, especially since pregnant and breastfeeding patients may be more interested in using natural medicines to avoid harm to their baby with maybe, uh, more like OTC medicines.

00:20:38 Don Weinberger:

Sure.

00:20:38 Jeff Langford:

Absolutely. Yeah.

00:20:40 Don Weinberger:

And also, I think elderberry from I was reading on it, it was it does seem like the immune system. So there are theoretical interactions with autoimmune diseases like rheumatoid arthritis with actually immunosuppressant medications like Cyclosporin. So something to keep a look out for at patient profile so everyone getting the same page and try to spot those interactions. So let's go ahead and go back to that claim. And it is elderberry can treat the flu. And the verdict is. True with conditions elderberry can reduce severity but not duration of flu symptoms. And there are some safety considerations to consider before patients try it.

00:21:20 Steve Small:

Yeah. And you know, this is making me think I actually am seeing tons of recipes online, uh, from people swearing by elderberry tonics that they're making at home. And I wonder how effective that really is for flu symptoms like sore throat. Uh, what are your thoughts on this, Jeff? Is it just a good mixer? Does it actually have evidence? Like, what are we talking about?

00:21:40 Jeff Langford:

Well, I think it's a spirited idea, Steve. Um, alcohol is not been actually shown to relieve flu symptoms like sore throat, but anecdotally, we've heard about it for years, and it's possible that these kind of hot toddies might make people feel a little better just because of the warm liquid, or the lemon or the honey that are included in them. So that may be some thoughts behind it, but bottom line is anecdotal only.

00:22:07 Steve Small:

Yeah, not strong evidence, but sounds like it could be fun to try.

00:22:12 Don Weinberger:

Yeah, just on any podcast that day, Steve, I promise.

00:22:15 Steve Small:

Yeah.

00:22:15 Don Weinberger:

Yeah. So before we get into our next claim, a quick reminder if you're enjoying this episode and want access to even more clinical insights, check out pharmacist's letter, Pharmacy Technician Letter, or Pharmacist Prescriber Insights. As a listener, you can get ten percent off a new or upgraded subscription with the code Rvx one zero two five at checkout.

00:22:36 Steve Small:

Great. And let's recap here before we go into our next claim. We started with vitamin C and zinc, added a spoonful of honey and took a very careful look at elderberry. Now let's see if our last claim is also something sweet or frankly, just too good to be true. And it's a homeopathic product such as Oscillococcinum can prevent or treat the flu.

00:22:58 Don Weinberger:

And before we let Jeff loose on this one, just to define that homeopathic product is a remedy made from plants, minerals and animals that is prepared through a process of extreme dilution and shaking.

00:23:10 Steve Small:

Right. It's based on the principle that like cures like meaning a substance that causes symptoms in a healthy person can be used in a highly diluted form to treat similar symptoms in a sick person.

00:23:22 Don Weinberger:

Right. So a good sum up and I pronounce it as oscillococcinum. But, uh, as, as one of the popular ones. Uh, but, Steve, since you're highlighted on that one, I want you to spell that one for us.

00:23:34 Steve Small:

Especially since I screwed that up. Uh. Let's see. Oscillococcinum o c I l l o c o c c I n um oscillococcinum.

00:23:48 Don Weinberger:

Let's say. That's right. Good job.

00:23:49 Steve Small:

Could I pass the spelling bee? Yeah. Well, Jeff, can you give us the lowdown on this particular homeopathic product. I don't want to say it again. Yeah.

00:23:58 Jeff Langford:

And I think I'm going to try to steer clear of the pronunciation there as well. Steve, just just to give that a wide berth based on the history so far. But I will tell you a fun fact about it. Um, that particular product, the Oscillococcinum, does come from the heart and liver of wild ducks. So kind of very interesting sourcing to have in the background as we think about the claim. And there are some data to suggest that homeopathic remedies based on that product may reduce the symptoms and need for those rescue meds and flu pain and fever medications. But I think we have to put a big caveat on this one that the research is potentially biased based on industry funding and poor methodology in the study design. And on top of that, the benefit that they detected honestly might just be too small to even make a difference to patients. So we'd chalk this one up as insufficient evidence so far.

00:24:52 Don Weinberger:

Right. So this might be quackery. In the end.

00:24:58 Steve Small:

You say perhaps, Don. So when it comes to this claim that homeopathic products such as Oscillococcinum can prevent or treat the flu, the verdict is. Rumor. And I think probably our next Rumor vs Truth episode should be how to pronounce some of these names. So in general, we should lean away from these as cold and flu remedies, since typically homeopathic products don't have strong evidence.

00:25:29 Don Weinberger:

Right. So if there was only a homeopathic remedy for our bad puns.

00:25:34 Steve Small:

Only time will tell. Don. So, Jeff, what's the bottom line truth we should share with our listeners today?

00:25:40 Jeff Langford:

Yeah, I think we can take away that some natural medicines can be used for cold and flu treatment. So we talked about zinc, for example, to shorten cold duration. Honey being helpful for cough in kids. Potentially elderberry in the flu. But it's always important for us to help people sort out the claims, keep the actual size of the benefit in perspective, and don't forget about the downsides that can go with any therapy that we add. Um, of course, the things we talked about today really are just the tip of the iceberg with natural medicines for cold and flu. So people are going to get questions about other things like n-acetylcysteine, Panax, ginseng, and lots of other things. So I want to point folks back to our Natmed Pro product. It's a great resource. You can look up all the things we talked about today, and all of the other things that patients may ask you about to really drill down the solid, evidence based advice that you can share with patients and with other health care providers as well.

00:26:36 Steve Small:

Excellent points, Jeff, and thank you for joining us today and sharing your expertise.

00:26:41 Don Weinberger:
  Yes, Jeff, thank you for letting us your brain today. Uh, is there any parting news?

00:26:47 Jeff Langford:

First of all, thanks for having me. It was really fun to have this conversation with you and find some other people that like puns as much as I do. But anyway, thanks for the opportunity and the news I do want to talk about Don, is that today's discussion is exactly the kind of thing we're going to cover on a new show that I'm hosting natural medicines, evidence and practice. The idea there is simple we're going to take the latest supplements and integrative therapies, translate it into practical point of care guidance where self-launching now and your interest guys what we're going to build. First join the notification list via the link in the show notes so you don't miss episode one. Then if you're already in your podcast app, tap below to listen to the trailer and follow on Apple, Spotify, or whatever platform you prefer to use.

00:27:31 Steve Small:

Love that evidence, not hype. Just like what we do here, and I'm excited for what you guys come up with. So join the list and follow the feed now. So you're set for launch. All right. So while Jeff's heading out, uh, but Don and I will stick around to answer a listener question from our last episode.

00:27:49 Don Weinberger:

Yes. So one of your emailed us at our room Versus Truth at TRC Healthcare.com email address and they asked us, can ADHD stimulants like Adderall and Vyvanse cause tooth decay?

00:28:01 Steve Small:

Yeah, interesting question there. And well, when I think of ADHD medications, particularly stimulant types like dextroamphetamine, methylphenidate, things like that, those can contribute to tooth decay and other oral health issues, mainly due to their side effects.

00:28:16 Don Weinberger:

So which one of the side effects are particularly concerning for dental issues?

00:28:21 Steve Small:

Yeah, it really boils down to the fact that stimulants can cause dry mouth. Saliva is important because it helps wash away food particles on the teeth, and also contains buffering agents that help us neutralize acids in the mouth. And higher acidity, as we know, can cause enamel erosion, which can then increase the risk of cavities. Also, you can see bruxism with stimulants, and that's where you clench or grind your teeth, especially at night. And as you can guess, this is going to lead to more enamel erosion and also tooth sensitivity along with that.

00:28:52 Don Weinberger:

Right. So the listeners are probably parched for recommendations here. So what do you have for us for treating dry mouth?

00:28:58 Steve Small:

Yeah, really it's ensuring patients stay hydrated to combat dry mouth. They can use a sugar free gum or lozenges to really stimulate that saliva production. Or um, or even more importantly, is maintaining regular dental checkups and cleanings. We should all be doing that, and they can consider nightguard if they're having this bruxism or teeth grinding problem too. Perfect.

00:29:20 Don Weinberger:

Yep. I'm sure Doctor Chalmers, a dentist from our lab. Rumors is truth episode would agree. So thank you. Steve. Uh, if you have any natural medicine claim that you want us to dig up, send it in. We might. Maybe we'll shake something loose in a future episode. Email us at truth at healthcare.com or send us a text right from the podcast show notes.

00:29:40 Steve Small:

Yeah, we know you got some great ideas for us to demystify and in this episode planted a seed of knowledge. Be sure to follow, rate and review Rumor vs Truth wherever you get your podcasts. And of course, check us out at TRC Healthcare.com.

00:29:53 Don Weinberger:

Com you can also help grow our show by telling a friend about the awesome things you've learned about and where you found us, and a quick reminder for our special ten percent discount we mentioned earlier. Just use the code RV one zero two five when you check out.

00:30:07 Steve Small:

Yeah, and if you're a student, even better students can access a free version of Pharmacist Letter. We've got links in the show notes that take you directly to the right places to take advantage of these awesome deals, so go check them out.

00:30:19 Don Weinberger:

Also, don't forget, you can also get CE credit for listening to room versus truth. Click the claim credit link in the show notes and search for it in your CE organizer, and join us next time where we'll digest claims about side effects with GLP one for weight loss.

00:30:34 Steve Small:

Yeah, thanks for joining us on Rumor vs Truth, your trusted source for facts, where we dissect the evidence behind risky rumors and reveal clinical truths. See you next time.